BBC On The Record - Broadcast: 11.06.00

Film: PAOLA BUONADONNA talks to the President of the European Commission, Romano Prodi, about his vision for the future of the EU.



PAOLA BUONADONNA: This mild-mannered university professor taking a stroll with his wife is one of the most powerful politicians in Europe. When he was appointed to head the European Commission in Brussels last September Romano Prodi had a sparkling reputation. He had brought Italy into the Euro zone during his time as Prime Minister and had been personally picked by the main governments in Europe including Britain, as the man who would resurrect the reputation of the Brussels executive. The previous President, Jacques Santer, and his commissioners had just resigned amid accusations of financial mismanagement, nepotism and corruption. I met Romano Prodi in his home town of Bologna and I asked him if he had been intimidated by the job he inherited from Mr Santer. ROMANO PRODI: If you consider which were the relations between the Commission and the governments when I arrived in Brussels you know that was a desperate situation. You know I knew that the job was difficult. I am not surprised you know because to keep countries with people and bureaucracy together you know and to try to show to have one coherent strategy is not easy. BUONADONNA: The Brussels press core is the biggest in the world - every week journalists from all over Europe gather to quiz commission spokesmen in this briefing room. Nine months into his tenure Mr Prodi's leadership is under intense scrutiny. Europe faces huge challenges - as it prepares to welcome new member countries and to reform its institutions. It's vital for Romano Prodi to show that he is the right man for the job and not just a last-minute compromise. But the affable persona which made him the darling of the press at the beginning of his journey has now been turned against him. He's been criticised for a series of diplomatic blunders, for unguarded comments about the future of Europe and for mismanaging his relations with the media. PRODI: If you want to change you have to make people unhappy you know. And the media they are merely listening to people who have been made unhappy by my first actions you know so this is life you know. But you know I didn't accept, accept this commitment in order to be popular. BUONADONNA: Another criticism is that you made some diplomatic mistakes early on such as inviting Gadaffi to Brussels. PRODI: Without giving up any principle, I said why we don't start talking. And then had such a tremendous negative reaction. And then when I went to Cairo for the meeting of African and European leader all the European Prime Minister were queuing in front of Gadaffi you know. I had to wait hours to meet Gadaffi because my former colleagues were meeting him you know, so it was a mistake or it was some forward looking idea. BUONADONNA: It's 8 am, every week Prodi meets with his closest advisers before the regular commission meeting. He has set out an ambitious plan for the internal reform of the commission, ending the convention of countries always running the same departments, linking promotion to merit rather than seniority and asking officials to take personal responsibility for the mistakes of their departments. The reforms have been very unpopular and not just in Brussels PRODI: I do understand that this is a long range effort and you can't have results at the beginning so if you mean that from many points of view I was highly unpopular in this first of all, I said yes. Yes. Yes. And I think I shall be for some other time in the future. Because you can't, you can't make surgery operations without you know making some cut. Well, you can use other instruments but generally you know when you have to heal a body you have to cut it. BUONADONNA: Is this it or can more be done in future? PRODI: No, the reform of the Commission is never ended. Never ended. And this is, this is what must be done. And without it you cannot have a working Europe, you cannot have you know. This is, this is the most unknown challenge you know because people are not interested of this. But I spend half of my time to put the house in order. I don't know if I shall succeed. BUONADONNA: An hour later Mr Prodi arrives at the weekly meeting of the commission. But even here there have been allegations that he doesn't enjoy the full loyalty of all his colleagues - a German newspaper suggested that British commissioners Neil Kinnock and Chris Patten were poised to replace him. PRODI: No, this is completely untrue. My commissioners are strong men and women, I should wish that any European government has such strong men and women as my commissioners are. We work together and there is also the feeling of happiness you know of you know, people enjoy to work. Of course in all the collective bodies there are moments of tension BUONADONNA: The following day in Lisbon Romano Prodi sets off to meet Bill Clinton at a US European Union summit hosted by the Portuguese Presidency. Mr Prodi is here to represent the European institutions. Relations with the US, on trade and on defence, have not been smooth recently, so meetings like this are more than courtesy calls. The EU is trying to forge a coherent foreign and defence policy to complement its strong single market. Mr Prodi is trying to ensure the commission has a central role. Romano Prodi is used to international gatherings like this - as a former Italian Prime Minister - but he has been criticised for presenting himself as the head of the European Government. And now some wonder whether he has the right vision for the European Union and the ability to see it through. Mr Prodi says his vision for Europe isn't modelled on the United States. He is careful to avoid any suggestion of a federal super-state. Mr Prodi sees European integration in terms of a 'network' - which works with the present structure of regional, national and European institutions, devolving power wherever possible but, controversially, with a stronger commission at its centre. PRODI: This is a definition that is very, very - the guarantee for freedom. Of course, but not because of that you need a stronger Commission, but you need a stronger Commission because the needs are so important you know. BUONADONNA: Back at his home in Italy after the summit Mr Prodi prepares for the coming week. As head of the European Commission his biggest challenge is to oversee preparations for the admission into the EU of a dozen new countries. It's a huge undertaking and progress has been slow. Romano Prodi would like to see Europe ready to welcome new countries by 2003 and needs to make sure Europe gets it right. But there are signs that some member states are cooling on the idea. PRODI: What I am afraid from the enlargement is that if we don't do it well our public opinions - British, Italian, French and German - they will be scared and they will stop it. BUONADONNA: So it would be a failure for the Union if enlargement didn't happen quickly? PRODI: It certainly would be a failure for me. I link my presidency to the enlargement. BUONADONNA: But there is a deadline looming. Before new members can enjoy the benefits of European membership Europe itself must complete difficult internal reforms - to be agreed in a new Treaty by the end of the year. The reforms could cause problems for the British government. Mr Prodi wants member states to give up the right to veto in many more areas and to extend the use of Qualified Majority Voting or QMV, where a decision can be taken by a substantial majority of countries even if others are against. PRODI: You know when you are three families you can go at unanimity. But if you are twenty families it is difficult to have the unanimity. This is why the Intergovernmental Conference is so important, you know, we can survive without it but very, very, very badly. BUONADONNA: Would you like to see QMV in items such as taxation? PRODI: When it's a danger for the single market. You know if you through your taxation you compete against me and you make me going in bankruptcy well I think that we have to harmonise this type of taxation. BUONADONNA: Taxation is only one of many controversial issues in Europe at the moment. The poor performance of the single currency, which has lost more than 15 per cent of its value since its launch last year, is casting a shadow on the whole monetary union project. But the Commission President won't accept that the Euro is a weak currency. PRODI: I don't know what is a weak currency, you know the Euro - look the, the European Central Bank it works well. The eurobond market is bigger than the dollar bond market. The agreement on how to manage the rate of interest is perfect. I do simply think that the Euro will be a currency in not a too long time probably equivalent to the Dollar. BUONADONNA: But now we're seeing Greece and soon Denmark and Sweden joining possibly within the next three years we'll see them all in, how can Britain stay out? PRODI: Well I could answer that it is your problem you know. But a lot will depend also upon the fluctuation of the pound you know it's, you had difficult case in the last month of competition for the British economy you know and it is clear that a country like Britain must be competitive. We had some case that made me thinking about that you know. The Rover case, BMW and other problem for in which the export companies were under pressure because of the rate of exchange. In my opinion some day it will become convenient. But it depends upon our behaviour. Lets say if the Euro will deliver as I think it would be difficult to stay out. If not will be easy and happy to stay out. BUONADONNA: Vision alone may not enough - some say that Romano Prodi has failed to garner enough political support of the countries that matter. France and Germany have traditionally driven European integration but their alliance has weakened making the job of the European Commission President all the more difficult. What's more the remaining big issues in Europe are increasingly being resolved by governments acting amongst themselves rather than through the commission. Europe seems less keen on big ideas these days. Many governments have domestic distractions and scepticism with European integration has surfaced even in Germany. The old consensus that succeeded in launching the Euro has faded and Mr Prodi wants Europe to find a new sense of unity. PRODI: The spirit of Europe was born with the six countries and you know Franco German alliance is a guarantee for, is a glue, lets express for that you know. So I work at a lot for that. BUONADONNA: After a weekend at home Romano Prodi heads back to Brussels. The French and the Germans are trying to regain the initiative in time for the French Presidency next month. The German Foreign Minister has suggested that European integration can only be kept on track by reinforced co-operation - where a few countries are allowed to forge ahead in certain areas. The British government is nervous that they will be left at the margins of Europe. But Mr Prodi has embraced the idea. PRODI: Yes, this is for clear you know. It's clear if you have a long train and you have a few wagons that can go only thirty kilometres per hour, you know all the train will be a failure you know. And so it's - you have rules and this is why I think that the so called reinforced co-operation is among willing countries must include many countries, not only one or two, two or three countries let's say. And second must be open. BUONADONNA: But there's a ready made core group of countries which could decide to move forward. They are the countries which have joined the single currency, whose finance ministers meet in the so-called Euro 11. The British government fears that the Euro 11, from which it is excluded, could become the economic and political engine of Europe. But Mr Prodi believes it should be strengthened. PRODI: Yes. Euro 11 as a consequence... because of its nature will require stronger co-operation. The problem of harmonising our action in the field of Euro is very very important you know, and I think that we need to take action in this direction. You need some instrument of political economy that you call instrument to fight against erratic shocks let's say you know. Unforeseen events that, and so the Euro is an instrument to reinforce the co-operation. BUONADONNA: The Commission President took over his post during a difficult time when the European institutions faced a crisis of confidence. He feels Europe's worst enemy is stagnation. Despite the fears of some countries including Britain he believes it's once again time to press ahead with political integration PRODI: Everybody was writing the debate about Europe is over you know and I know history of European Union is so simple. You have years in which you sleep. You have to consolidate to think it over and then the years of progress. We have the enormous effort for the Euro, it was an enormous effort you know. And then you had to just to sleep for a while and then the debate is here again because we understand that we have to interpret history. BUONADONNA: Romano Prodi might have been Tony Blair's personal choice when he took his new post nine months ago. But if he succeeds with his plans for political integration in Europe it could herald a very difficult time ahead for the British Government and it could jeopardise Labour's ambition to be at the heart of Europe.
NB. This transcript was typed from a transcription unit recording and not copied from an original script. Because of the possibility of mis-hearing and the difficulty, in some cases, of identifying individual speakers, the BBC cannot vouch for its accuracy.