BBC On The Record - Broadcast: 29.10.00

Film: DOME VT. Paul Wilenius reports that the Government is facing more embarrassment over the Dome.



PETER MANDELSON: If the Millennium Dome is a success, it will never be forgotten. If it is a failure, we will never be forgiven. PAUL WILENIUS: Former Dome Minister Peter Mandelson may be needing some forgiveness. The cost of the Millennium Dome has almost reached a staggering �1 billion pounds. But for Tony Blair's government there is also a high political price to pay. Ministers will soon be criticised by official inquiries into the project and then they'll face embarrassing votes in the Commons and the Lords over the cash used to keep it going. Thousands turned up for their amazing day at the Dome last week. But ministers' dreams that 12 million people would pack into the great exhibition have turned into a nightmare. ACTUALITY Blood curdling financial losses are the result of an unexpected drop in visitor numbers to only six million. Now many people want to find out what went wrong. PETER AINSWORTH MP: There's very serious trouble ahead on the Dome as gradually, bit by bit, and inch by inch the truth comes out about this project. At the moment there's a great deal of ignorance about what actually really went wrong and who was responsible, and over the next few months we will be seeing how this huge national project came to be the national disgrace, that it is today, WILENIUS: Ministers will learn in two weeks the contents of the key report from the National Audit Office on the Dome , which is run by NMEC, the New Millenium Experience Company. It's expected to be a brutal reminder of the Dome disaster and will put the everyone involved a black mark. Ministers could not have foreseen the incompetence that's dogged the project. But the shock waves from the report could well reach the very centre of government. BOB MARSHALL-ANDREWS MP: The impact of the National Audit Report cannot be overstated. It is going to be a devastating criticism of NMEC but that in truth is a devastating criticism of the Government. Now, the problem here, of course, was the way in which it was set up - is this a Government body or is it not a Government body? And everybody understands the principle that in truth this is Government. And Government money at the end of the day will be put at risk. DIANA ORGAN MP: I do have concerns that I think it will show that management was lax, that there weren't the financial controls in place, and that there was almost a disregard for the amount of money that was being spent. It was like we've turned on the tap and it might not stop and it doesn't really have to be accountable. So I think that may come out but we'll have to wait and see for that and I suspect that the Select Committee will have to revisit another inquiry on the Dome in the light of this. WILENIUS: Over estimating the numbers of people who would turn up to the Dome was the biggest single financial problem. But the new Dome Chairman feels mistakes were made in the panic to get it open on time. DAVID JAMES: The closer it got to the opening day there must have been tremendous pressures mounting on everybody concerned and I'm sure that at that time a great many things occurred which took short cuts, short corners which we're still having to sort out today. The contracts to which you refer are one thing, the incompleteness of the asset register, which has already been well publicised is obviously another very big factor. WILENIUS: But was lofty ambition also a factor? In the post election euphoria, the project was given the go ahead by Tony Blair, even though in the past the public have often given grand schemes a large raspberry. It was hoped it would define New Labour's success. But as there was little real control over the fast moving project, senior Labour figures feel it may have been too ambitious for the Blair government. DOUG HENDERSON MP: I think people got carried away, I think that is what actually happened, kind of they look back and said there was the great Victorian exhibitions, there was the big exhibitions in the 1930s after the Coronation, what can we do this time for the millennium, let's build a big Dome and then let's try and think of something to put inside it. They didn't need this large structure costing a colossal amount of money, these, that could have been done in a better way more cheaply. WILENIUS: Even though the government will face criticisms over its handling of the project, it could choose to ignore them. But there's a much more serious problem, Ministers need the approval of Parliament to extend the life of the Millennium Commission beyond New Year's Eve. That's because they need more lottery money to compensate for the extra cash given to the Dome. So as time runs out for the Dome, these votes will give its critics the opportunity to unleash fresh attacks on Ministers. There may even be a rebellion in the Commons over the measure. Fifty Labour MP s are backing a Commons motion tomorrow calling for a full debate on the move to give more lottery money to the Millennium Commission. MARSHALL-ANDREWS: I think that the public and members of Parliament have had enough of the take it or leave it, it's going to cost more money not to put more money in than otherwise - that argument which is plainly spurious. The argument is used in order to lever more money out of the Millennium Commission. Because the Government knows full well that if the Millennium Commission doesn't give this money and ultimately the Dome then falls - which it should do, as a commercial venture - then the Government is going to be left with the bill and then, you will have accountability. And that I am afraid is what the Government is worried about. WILENIUS: Here children at the Dome try their hand at voting. But it's not only the vote in the Commons, but also the one in the Lords that's causing a lot of worry. There are now demands for the sacking of Dome Minister Lord Falconer as the price the government has to pay, to get it through. AINSWORTH I don't think the House of Lords will be remotely impressed to see Lord Falconer, of all people, coming back with a begging bowl for the Dome. He's the man who said there wasn't a problem at all. He's the man who eventually had to put up his hand and say there was. He's now the man who says he's going to stay there and see the project through to the end. Many people find it astonishing that he's still in position. He is the minister responsible for an enormous financial disaster. And if the Government wants to get more money through Parliament, in any way related to the Dome, I cannot imagine a worse person to put that question, than Lord Falconer. WILENIUS: It'll take more than this one million pounds featured in the Dome Money Zone to fill the financial black hole left by the project. No one yet knows exactly how big that hole will be. So Labour MPs are reluctant to write out a blank cheque for the Dome. ORGAN: My view about extending the life of the Millennium Commission to just fund the Dome would be that I wouldn't support that. But of course I have concerns about wanting to extend the Millennium Commission because there are many other projects which are fantastic, that are being carried out in the regions that maybe jeopardised if we don't. What I don't want to find is that we're being duped in to believing that those would be in jeopardy if we don't extend the Millennium Commission and that to discover that the finances being funnelled away to support the Dome, WILENIUS: The aim is to wrap up the exhibition without needing more money. But the ever growing cost doesn't include the high price of getting the site ready for a buyer, which could increase the burden already placed on the public. JAMES: It does not cover and has never been intended to cover the decommissioning of the Dome itself in full, or whatever strategy is going to come for the future of the Dome, because that depends on what is needed by whoever buys it and it's quite possible they will want to buy it in its present form or that they will want modified decommissioning or whatever else, and so we would expect that the costs for a very substantial programme of decommissioning would be covered significantly out of any proceeds of the sale or out of the proceeds of however the area was developed or the proceeds that came from that. HENDERSON: I think the government have to really cut losses now. Nobody believes that there will be no future demands for further money. We've already had four additional demands this year, the last in September, which brought the total increase in public funds to a hundred and seventy-nine million. A lot of people believe they will come back for more and I think it is important for the government to make sure that the book is closed now, that there is no begging bowl, that they have got to sort it out. WILENIUS: As the time for fun in the Play Zone ebbs away, Ministers are looking for a way out. There are calls for a public inquiry, the sort of political interaction the government may wish to avoid. But to head off open displays of discontent in the run up to the next election, the government may have to own up to its mistakes. Confront the fact, that it got it wrong, to accept that the only way to put things right could be to flatten the Dome. AINSWORTH: If it is the case, as we hear that clearing the site, getting rid of the Dome, would realise an additional three hundred million pounds, we want to know that. That should be information available to Parliament before anybody comes along and says, we need to extend the life of the Millennium Commission, incidentally taking money out of education and health projects, in order to pay off the Dome's problems. We need to know if it is conceivable, that by clearing the site, an additional three hundred million pounds could be raised, then that is information that is absolutely relevant to any vote which may be taken on extending the life of the Millennium Commission. WILENIUS: Are you worried that you may not be able to sustain it - the Dome? JAMES: There has to be a possibility that unless a buyer comes along and is prepared to see a constructive purpose to the future of the Dome which fits into their plan then the Dome will have to be considered either first in the first instance for alternative usage in some leisure, sports or maybe some business park context, but alternatively beyond there then comes the value of the land and the development of the development of the peninsula, the whole Greenwich peninsula which is a vast area, as I say. It's the biggest undeveloped area in the whole of London. WILENIUS: The Dome was supposed to be an amazing triumph for the New Labour government. But even Cabinet Ministers are openly admitting it has been a disaster. Now Tony Blair can only hope that it is a distant memory for voters when they go to the polls next year. HENDERSON: It doesn't help our electoral cause at the next election. I think people are very realistic and the Dome is not the most important issue in politics in this country today. But I think people will want the government to come clean on it, where there are mistakes admit the mistakes MARSHALL-ANDREWS: I think that the electoral consequences of a failure to take responsibility of this will be dire. And the way in which you do it, I'm afraid, is that ministers need to take responsibility and resign. And there needs to be a full public inquiry. Now in those circumstances the electoral, or the political consequences, will be minimal because the Government will be perceived to have acted in the way that governments should. Everybody makes mistakes. The most important thing is to acknowledge them to the public and then to put them right. WILENIUS: Tony Blair, Peter Mandelson and Lord Falconer all put their trust in the Dome. They hoped it would be a symbol of the future for a New Labour government and a new Britain. But its financial failure means that even though millions have liked it, critics will use it to attack the government's record and image. Bold and glossy on the outside, but ultimately empty inside. So as long as the Dome's there they'll find it hard to shake off this impression, even when the lights finally go out, on New Year's Eve.
NB. This transcript was typed from a transcription unit recording and not copied from an original script. Because of the possibility of mis-hearing and the difficulty, in some cases, of identifying individual speakers, the BBC cannot vouch for its accuracy.