BBC On The Record - Broadcast: 21.01.01

Film: Iain Watson examines the current state of the peace process in Northern Ireland.



IAIN WATSON: Northern Ireland's pro-agreement parties are in conflict - each has been fighting its corner in intense negotiations. The military presence has been reduced across the province, but that's not so obvious if you live in a border town such as Crossmaglen in South Armagh. Sinn Fein are demanding a further scaling down of the security forces; the usually moderate SDLP, won't yet give its backing to the reform of the policing service and the Unionists want to see a start made on decommissioning by the IRA. The government is keen to break this deadlock within the next ten days. There's a very narrow window of opportunity this month for any deal to be struck. That's because pretty soon, minds will be focussed on fighting the forthcoming local council elections here in Northern Ireland and the widely expected General Election in the spring and the danger is if this opportunity isn't seized then the whole peace process could unravel. David Trimble's Ulster Unionists may feel they can no longer sit in government with Sinn Fein if there's no further progress on decommissioning. And if the institutions of the Good Friday Agreement are suspended, then it could be more difficult than ever before to resurrect them. A rustic scene that could be straight out of the home counties. But as this quiet country lane is in Northern Ireland, Henry McElroy's worries aren't of a purely agricultural nature. He's one of fifteen members of the South Armagh farmers and residents association. This pressure group say they have no links to Sinn Fein but, like that party, they want a very visible British military presence in the border areas cut back, and the network of army watchtowers dismantled. HENRY MCELROY: My message down here in the border counties straight to Tony Blair is take charge of the peace process and pull these obstacles here down -that's it. WATSON: Hopes for peace have been heightened by the continued IRA ceasefire but the army say they must remain vigilant. Just a week ago, a one thousand pound bomb -twice the size of the one which devastated Omagh - was found in rural South Armagh, planted by dissident republicans. The security forces say while a threat remains, at least some of the watchtowers must stay. Senior security sources have confirmed that they are willing to reduce the British Army presence in Northern Ireland still further - just so long as the IRA makes much more progress towards decomissioning. But this wouldn't involve the actual handing over of weapons. Instead, if the IRA would have to put them beyond use, for example but concreting over their arms dumps, or pouring concrete over the weapons themselves, then this would be interpreted as a substantial reduction in the IRA threat. Then, in turn, the British military presence could be scaled down. But all this is dependent on timing and trust - both present here at Hillsborough last May when a detailed deal was struck. First the IRA announced that they would contact General de Chastelain's commission on decommissioning. Then the RUC announced the timetable for the closure of some military bases. After that, the inspection of some IRA arms dumps by two international observers took place. Then, in due course, the British military bases actually began to close. It's this sort of sequencing which the government think can form the basis of a new deal. But Sinn Fein say the British government didn't fully keep to their side of the bargain last time and that could cause problems now. MITCHELL MCLAUGHLIN MLA: Tony Blair on behalf of the British Government spelt out a certain set of actions which was responded to within twenty-four hours by the IRA. Now quite clearly there was a degree of negotiation and choreography in that and that set out if you like the sequence of events. But what we got instead was resistance at very high level indeed within the British Army and probably within the political establishment which prevented demilitarisation as was described and intended presumably by Tony Blair. KEN MAGINNIS MP: I talked directly to the Prime Minister, he said, 'I did not make any commitments on which I have reneged, what Sinn Fein suggest is not true.' He has said it as bluntly as that and I believe him. I just think that Sinn Fein need wriggle room and they are taking more than they are entitled to. WATSON: But a lot depends on interpretation. The former patrol base at Clonnaty Bridge, just two miles from the Irish Republic, was being dismantled by army engineers last week. But we understand an indicative timetable for the removal of army watchtowers in the border area, agreed to at Hillsborough last May, hasn't been fully adhered to. And we've been told the reasons include not only the threat from dissident Republicans, but also because the IRA's only contact with General de Chastelain's decommisioning body since May has been one solitary telephone call. The government are keen to point out that they have moved first on what they call 'normalisation' and Sinn Fein call 'demilitarisation'. When the IRA announced their first ceasefire in 1994 there were one hundred and five army bases in the province. By the start of this year this had fallen to sixty-three. But there's been less progress on the lookout posts or watchtowers which line the border with the Irish Republic. Of the fifteen which existed at the time of the first IRA ceasefire, thirteen are still in place. The army say much more progress has been made in reducing troop numbers in the province over the same period. There were seventeen thousand troops in Northern Ireland but by the start of this year twelve thousand, six hundred remain. Meanwhile, the IRA haven't handed over a single weapon. SIR RONNIE FLANAGAN: If they move in tangible ways whereby the overall threat is reduced, then we would welcome that, very warmly, and we would move very quickly imaginatively and progressively into make yet further steps along the road towards normalisation WATSON: The IRA aren't quite as open as the army over revealing the number of volunteers or weapons at their disposal. But reliable estimates suggest they have in the region of one thousand rifles, six hundred handguns, five hundred heavy machine guns and two and a half tons of the highly explosive substance, Semtex. These estimates exclude numerous rocket launchers and mortars and of course the substantial arsenal of weapons now in the hands of dissident republicans. FLANAGAN: If an organisation moved publicly to demonstrate that it no longer felt a need for such a capability, that it was reducing that capability, I have no doubt that that would be interpreted as a reduction in the overall threat. WATSON: There's been a spate of sectarian attacks on Catholics recently - with anything from crude pipe bombs to bricks being used as weapons. Individual members of the loyalist paramilitary group, the UDA, are thought to be responsible, but there are fears that the UDA itself may walk out of the peace process and that could make it more difficult for the IRA to put their own weapons beyond use. The RUC are well aware of the risks. FLANAGAN: I have no doubt that violence begets violence and we have seen that down through 30 years here. We have seen a vicious cycle, where one act of violence brings about a violent act of retaliation Undoubtedly the more these organisations degenerate into acts of violence, the more we move back towards that risk of going down a vicious downward spiral WATSON: Loyalist paramilitaries have less extensive arsenals than the IRA but still have the capacity to pose a substantial threat. Estimates suggest they have 200 rifles, 300 machine guns, 900 handguns and an unknown amount of explosives at their disposal. So, against this grim backdrop, Tony Blair is keen to keep the pro-agreement parties together in government here at Stormont. But, sources say, he doesn't want an 'elastoplast' arrangement which won't cure the sort of underlying grievances which could contaminate a General Election campaign. So, this week, he will continue to press for a comprehensive deal on decommissioning, demilitarization and policing. The hope is the deal will be just enough to keep the institutions here at Stormont functioning through a difficult General Election period. But if all that's on offer from the IRA is simply to resume contact with General de Chastelain's international commission on decommissioning then problems will remain. The one thing that will unite the Ulster Unionist party is to say that this kind of move by the IRA just isn't enough. MAGINNIS: We would discourage government from using up its last cards before it sees something that is more than a social visit to General de Chastelain, tea and chocolate biscuits is not what we are talking about, we are talking about modalities that can immediately begin to be put into effect to get rid of illegal weapons. I am not, nor has the Ulster Unionist Party endeavored to say, it must be done exactly like this, or exactly like that. Half of it is a physical manifestation of intent, the other half, is a psychological change in IRA attitude. It's a promise for the future. It's a sign of what will be. WATSON: This woman hopes to become her party's candidate to replace Ken Maginnis when he stands down at the next election. But here in the border seat of Fermanagh and South Tyrone, the Ulster Unionists fear a challenge from Ian Paisley's DUP. So Arlene Foster wants her party to take a tougher line on Republicans by imposing new sanctions on Sinn Fein unless the IRA begins to hand over their weapons, ARLENE FOSTER: We can step up the pressure, but if nothing has happened by March, for example, March was a date that was mentioned because its our annual general meeting in March, then I think we very firmly need to look at moving out of the executive. MITCHELL: There may be no way back for David Trimble but it is my view that both governments could actually deliver on ninety, ninety-five per cent of the elements of the Good Friday Agreement and that there is an argument in that, that the Unionists would find it very much in their interest to be part of those political institutions not outside them. WATSON: As if all that wasn't trouble enough, Policing reforms in Northern Ireland could founder on the demands of the Nationalist SDLP. These include a new police badge, the closure of an interrogation centre and independent inquiries into the murders of three prominent nationalists. And Sinn Fein have objections too. MITCHELL: We're all I think got very conscious of Nationalist public opinion, who have quite clearly, you know indisputably, have formed the view that this does not represent the new beginning in policing You know they're not impressed by an argument about fifty-fifty recruitment when you're talking about seventy recruits a year. Thirty-five Catholics in a force of ten thousand former RUC officers. WATSON: The government want both Nationalists and Republicans to join a new cross community police board by April this year. Sinn Fein are suspicious and are unlikely to do so but the government hopes that at least they won't actively discourage Catholics from becoming police officers and they've signaled privately that they may even offer concessions on scaling down the army presence in return. But they know if the SDLP don't go further and join the police board itself, the reforms have little chance of success. FLANAGAN: Policing to be fully effective has to be all about partnership. Now we are engaged in a whole range of partnerships right across communities, but if a very significant party like the SDLP actively decided to stay outside those arrangements, then it couldn't fully effectively work as it should. MAGINNIS: Well, I think quite honestly if you look objectively at the SDLP, they are pretty pathetic as far as policing is concerned. Day and daily we hear them on demanding that the police might do this better, might do this, might do the other thing, and yet they are saying, but we won't support them. Their argument, their case, doesn't stand up and I'll make a prediction; SDLP will be on board. I know they are running scared of Sinn Fein, but they will be on board because they know this society needs to be policed. WATSON: Once the British government has met with the Irish government this Tuesday even more pressure will be piled on the Pro-Agreement parties to ensure the peace process isn't the first victim of what will be a hard fought General Election campaign.
NB. This transcript was typed from a transcription unit recording and not copied from an original script. Because of the possibility of mis-hearing and the difficulty, in some cases, of identifying individual speakers, the BBC cannot vouch for its accuracy.